Musk’s Innovation Engine, the SaaS Reckoning, and Cybercriminals Unmasked | TSG Ep. 1012

Hey, happy Wednesday everyone. Welcome to Textron Gang Live. Great to have you on.

Um, we have a lot to talk about. Today's, you know, we're living every day. It just seems, I don't know if the news is just crazier or I'm crazier, or a little bit of both, but there's certainly so much going on in the world.

We have a hard time just filtering it and keeping it to three different segments. But we've got our three for today, and we've got a great gang to talk about it with. Let me, let me introduce you to our gang.

We have Terry Robinson Sands Glasses. She usually has her glasses on. Hi, Terry.

Hi. That's the Terry. We know we have Barbara Rose.

Barbara, welcome back. Of course, our man in the valley, John Swartz, and sitting up at the, uh, at the, uh, foundation of it all, our chief content officer, Mike Ard. Gang.

Welcome. Happy Wednesday to you all. I hope it's not snowing.

It's not too cold. It's warming back up here in Florida, though, I have to tell you, the iguanas that fell out of the trees, I thought when it warmed up, they'd revive. But I guess two days topi was too much, or three days, and I don't think they're coming back.

It's not necessarily a bad thing. They are a bit of a nuisance around here, but someone's gotta pick up all these dead iguanas. Um, anyway, Mike, beyond, uh, beyond the weather and iguanas, maybe it is sort of lizard like Elon Musk is, is in the news.

Um, what do we got? So, Elon Musk is now merging, I guess, SpaceX and X AI into one company, which also, I guess includes X these days. 25 trillion.

I don't know if that's another one of these made up numbers, but they, the issue seems to be he thinks that this is gonna become some sort of innovation engine. And others are wondering, John, is this like, just the, another example of some financial engineering that goes on in the ballot, uh, Like you hit the nail on the head, Mike? Um, I might look at this.

Uh, first of all, it must have been an interesting negotiation when Elon Musk was doing this deal with Elon Musk. It was, it was very, very weird. It's like an echo chamber.

It's almost like a right. It's like that Orson Wells movie, the Lady Shanghai, where there's a maze of mirrors and you don't know who's what or which. John, John, you're showing your age with that one, my friend.

I always do. Orson Wells, you know, In any event, um, yeah, the Novation engine, the idea that must says not. I have three versions of what might happen based on who I talk to or who you talk to, or who you listen to.

So he has this innovation idea to bypass earth's power restraints by launching this massive network of solar powered data centers into orbits. Okay? So he, that's how he's gonna solve AI's most pressing bottleneck that we always talk about, this energy and cooling requirements of data centers.

So I, uh, reached out and looked at a report that Nick patients from the Futurum group did, and he is kind of aligned with this idea. He thinks that in a sense, this combination of these two companies creates this vertical integration that would disrupt the cloud computing and satellite connectivity markets. And that in sense, SpaceX would become this full stack AI and infrastructure provider.

Okay? That's his viewpoint. Then we talk about the financial prism and the analysts.

So they look at this as a kinda a fin as a strategic bailout for xai, which is just burning through capital to keep pace with open AI and, and Google. So the idea is to fold it into the cash generative operations of SpaceX and create some sort of stable foundation for his AI plans. And yet there's, and those AI plans include a potential IPO in June of 2026.

When incidentally, he turns 55 years old. And this coincides with a planetary alignments. That's how he thinks.

Okay. And then there's the last version, and I will mercifully end this. Dan Ives, our friend in Wedbush, the very colorful Dan Ives looks at it as, as kind of a, maybe even more of a conglomeration, almost like a Frankenstein monster where Tesla would be involved.

Uh, Tesla has announced it's gonna invest $2 billion into Xai, um, to create this, this AI juggernaut. But what Ives is kind of hinting at is maybe this, this whole thing is, is Constellation or galaxy of companies are all splattered into one behemoth. Um, sounds like, uh, uh, acquisition strategy, looking for a way to monetize.

And, um, in the case of XIIX AI was absolutely necessary. All I Hear you say Was that I can watch AI porn while I'm driving now. Is that what No, If you, there's air planetary, You, you don't, Mike, you're not, you're not doing that now.

253 is a very interesting number. You notice how these numbers are always so nice and round and perfect. Yeah.

It, but here's the thing. 1 trillion of that is probably just SpaceX by itself. It's because hate Elon Musk, love Elon Musk.

SpaceX has been a success at, at, at, at the level of giving us some reliable, you know, lift into orbit capability that we were lacking with the end of the space shuttle program. Had we had not had that, we'd be totally dependent on the Russians, basically, which is not a very heartwarming or, or comfortable thought. So you gotta give him credit for that.

But let's face it, you don't think he has fantasies that he's Tony Stark or someone? Sure. And and he's putting this all together, but here, here, and here's the other point.

Yes. X AI is kind of like my boat. It's a hole in the water that we throw money into, right?

The fact of the matter is, for whatever reason, Tesla seems to be soured on being a car company anymore right after they went out. And I think that reason is they, they see all these Chinese electric car manufacturers that seem to have better range, cheaper, more features. And the only thing keeping them from flooding us in here is a hundred percent tariffs on them.

But with the rest of the world, uh, you know, expanding their trade options and not just the US Tesla does, is not gonna have a very big worldwide market compared to these other ones. So Tesla's kind of pivoting also into batteries and, uh, non-AI, non-car business. Robotics.

Robotics, excuse me. Yes, You're right. Energy for the ai you have infrastructure.

Exactly. So, so Tesla, you know, if you're an investor in Tesla, it's a little shaky as well. So what I think he's trying to do is take these two weak sisters and, and marry them to the, the strength that he has, which, which is SpaceX.

And, and by the way, look, Gizo Blue Origin and, and the other, you know, space companies out there are are nipping at his heels on this stuff too. And you know that, that when you're so busy trying to buy elections and cut government waste while you take, you know, people's information, maybe keep your eye on the ball. You had three great companies there.

Mm-hmm. Two of them are getting run of the ground. Is anybody actually using For anything that, you know, actually feels like a legitimate business purpose?

Or is it just kind Of, I think people who are on Twitter will ask grok a question while they're in Twitter. 'cause it promised you to That's the whole universe. That's it.

Is that is its whole universe. Maybe they use it on That's a Shrinking, I don't knows universe too. Yeah.

Yeah. But, you know, but, but, so this is the way this, the other thing is, you know, if you're a SpaceX shareholder, are you feeling like SpaceX is, is just doing what Elon wants and not really for the best interest of all of the rest of the shareholders? Will we see shareholder lawsuits coming out of this?

Because this clearly looks like what's best for Elon. It's Musk Inc. Yeah.

Gee, imagine that. Yeah. Wow.

We have, And it, and it kind of, it kind of, uh, speaks to why maybe he was so tight with the guy in the, the White House who seems to be Of the same I Focused Yeah. On himself. So I I, I read this one and I thought, you know, the, this cements his role as the ultimate tech pro because he took his, his dream tech, pro vision board, you know, with, with rockets and space stations and ai.

And he munged it all into one thing, you know, it's like the final tech bro crossover episode. Yeah. I mean, yeah.

You could just imagine how excited he was right about this. Oh, yeah. And the other thing is about the space data centers, if you read more into it, I mean, he's basically talking about almost creating what they call a Dyson sphere around the sun to take up a good concept of the good output to power these data centers.

But you're going to need all kinds of new compression and transmission algorithms, technology to get that data from space down here. By the way, I do think space is the final frontier. Someone said that earlier, did you Think?

Or at least the next frontier. The next frontier, no One. And, and there is, there's good business to be had out there.

We can mine asteroids. We can, we can do a lot, we can, a permanent base on the moon can do things. It's a little bit out there yet on us, but I don't know if space, space data centers is the best use of, of dollars spent in space.

I'm not even sure it's technically feasible. So, I mean, there's a lot of people running around saying, you know, we had Steven FoST on this show basically calling the whole idea poppycock. Well, but you know what?

It wasn't technically feasible when we went to the moon, but we go to the moon. Not because it's easy, but because it's hard. It is hard.

Yeah. And, uh, maybe that's why we build space data centers. Yeah.

Well that's what I, I, when I read this, I was kind of wondering, is it, you know, does this bring us this much closer or to get to space data centers quicker, if that is a thing? Or is this just like, you know, sort of the fantasy of every little boy I knew in third grade? Well, he, he is.

I mean, that, that's kind of his mindset, really. You know, I, I, should I, may I defend him briefly? I can't believe I'm saying this really.

May I say I can't, I'm having a a brain Go, go with it, John. You're among Friends, but Yeah. But in a sense, you know, I give him credit, at least for thinking big and thinking outside the box or outside the universe.

I mean, that was one of the criticisms a lot of us have in the valley is like how incremental the technology is. And yeah, no one wants to do a moonshot, and at least he's trying to think of something that may be unlikely or not feasible, but maybe it leads to something else. Um, so I'm gonna give him credit for that as, as Credit.

Oh, I do. I hundred percent agree with, with that. And you need ideas.

People, I guess it's like the execution, and it's the idea of how you spend your money and, you know, the health of those companies. Um, it, it can't just be, you know, like wild vision, right? It has to, there has to be some grounding in reality or a path.

And it, it has to be paired too with some morality, right? I mean, You know, look at, Look at his view on gr and then think about this. I mean, this is an extreme possibility, but how long before he blocks out the sun entirely and starts charging us subscription fees for access?

Right? There you go. He's Got, and he's got some willing customers and some friends in the government who are gonna, more than likely hand him a bunch of contracts and maybe try to create, remember how Trump had this fixation on trying to go back into space, although it was this kind of half-baked idea, like most of what he thinks, um, I, I have a kind of weird feeling that they're gonna try to figure out a way to reward him now that he's back in, back in.

Well, I, I think Jeff Bezos has, has worn his knee pads really well, and, and he is, he's making his play to, to for more, you know, SpaceX shouldn't be the only government space carrier. Yeah. Pete, hes has just met up with him.

There's a photo of him greeting of a video of, uh, We're trying to get up to Blue Origin to do a special video, uh, uh, coverage on that state tuned. I'm not gonna take any of this seriously till the president's crypto company invest. Boy, then I'll know as well.

It's part of the scheme. And you'll know they mean business. That's for sure.

It's, uh, what a what a what a what a tangled web. We, we, when we seek to deceive. 5, two 5 trillion, billion, zillion gazillion, it's only worth what someone's willing to write a check for.

And I think this is a big reason why he's been hesitant to IPO SpaceX to this point, why he, you know, wanted to take X or Twitter back out from being public. Because when you're doing things like this for the benefit of, let's say the largest shareholder, or I don't even know if he's the largest shareholder, given the amount of money he's raised and everything. But you, when you're public, you're subject to a lot more scrutiny.

You're subject to a lot more lawsuits. You're subject to a, a higher degree of fiduciary, you know, behavior. So I'm not holding my breath for him to go public with this stuff, because in, in, in Elon's case, it puts handcuffs on him.

Mm-hmm. Or at least constraints what he can do. Right.

And I don't think you as a public company can go to the board and say, I wanna invest trillions of dollars. My other company Just, yeah. Not without, I mean, you can, but there'll be lawsuits involved, you know?

So anyway, Musk, Inc. There you go. I, I think it was a good discussion.

Let's move to our next discussion. Another uplifting one, huh, Mike? Well, We did A lot of catter on Wall Street this past week where stocks are been getting beat up, especially for providers of software as a service applications.

'cause there's concerns that AI is gonna supersede these things and maybe just turn 'em all into a bunch of backend services that AI agents are gonna access. And, you know, the whole way we engage with software is gonna fundamentally change. And somebody on Wall Street seems to have figured out that that might represent a certain level of risk for the SaaS providers.

That's one way of looking at it. But Barbara, what's your take? Uh, my take is they're onto something.

I mean, you know, when I was at Intel, we used Salesforce and, and I felt like, you know, every week they were pitching us on some new, you know, add-on feature that was supposed to be out of the box. And then when we bought it, it would turn out, you know, there we had customized our instance of Salesforce so much that, um, nothing worked out of the box. You always had to have a bunch of engineering energy put into configuring it to make it work with our particular version of Salesforce.

And, um, a lot of change management to manage all the people impact through the change. So I, I feel like if companies are already looking at that much customization and effort to adopt something, why not invest in, you know, custom AI and, and automation that is going to be designed to work the way that their teams work as opposed to like themselves to work the way the vendor envisions something working. So I think it's a real threat to these SaaS vendors.

Um, and it, it's kind of exposing how much work has already been inside of companies to make these solutions work. And now they're gonna redirect some of that energy and see if they can, you know, roll their own with ai. Mm-hmm.

I, it's interesting, you know, not a SaaS company, but I don't know if you guys saw what happened to Gartner yesterday on the street. I mean, they were down 30% in the morning. I think they, they finished down still over 20% in one day.

And of course, Forrester took a beating just because they, they knew Gartner. Um, a Forrester's been on the rails for quite a While. Yeah.

But I mean, they got punished and they didn't even have news. They got punished because Gartner got punished. It just happened to me.

My younger brother would get in trouble. I would get punished too. We all didn't watch tv.

But anyway, um, here, here's the interesting thing why I bring up the Gartner thing. Gartner got hammered after reporting a fairly decent quarter. They beat the estimates, they beat earnings, and they still got hammered.

The, the article that goes to this section is an article I wrote, uh, it was around Salesforce, uh, not Salesforce, excuse me. Um, ServiceNow. ServiceNow had a good quarter.

They, again, they, they met, they exceeded expectations all around the business seems to be fairly healthy. ServiceNow is down 50% or something like that this year. You Know, it's what you're, you're they're, they've lost half their market value in a year, even though their earnings are good.

50 and Salesforce down. Yeah. And sales it's half.

Right. And Salesforce, down Salesforce is down 35%. Right?

It's down. And they're among the two worst with the bottom 10, uh, stocks performing so far that year. And again, this is a small sample size, but those are, those are in the two, those are in the bottom.

Yeah. But even, even Microsoft, which isn't Microsoft Su, they're down 4% in a year. Uh, Oracle for all of the deals and all the open AI funding money that flows between them and Oracle, their stock is only up 4%.

At one point, it was up like 30, 40%. It came flying back down like a, like a rock. So Barbara, I think what you said is true, which is at least on the street, they're saying, yeah, yeah, no, this is all nice, but AI's gonna wipe you all out if you don't fundamentally change your models.

I think this is the story with Gartner. I think this is the story with SaaS, I think, not necessarily a financial story, but I think there's a similar thing going on in open source. People are realizing, why, why should I be in the community of this open source project and let other people, you know, have to play by all these rules and everything else when I could just ask AI to write me the code for the functionality I'm looking for?

That's, So I was having a conversation, conversation, conversation with some folks in New York this week about this very same thing. And they're saying there's a future where, you know, we're not gonna need mobile apps or even websites. 'cause those are designed for humans.

And AI is just gonna pull whatever data you need, run through an API directly to you based on whatever parameters you've trained that AI to operate. Well, this is the, the death of the ux, right? The death of the ui.

Um, it's, it's a crazy time, right? Because for all of the gains in the stock market, they're really centered around anybody who's building or has something to do with building data centers. So the chips that go in the data centers, the energy for the data centers, the construction material for the data centers, you know, it's all about the data centers, this $8 trillion data center, you know, uh, pump.

And in the meantime, you know, you gotta give Nadella a credit. Satya Nadella, I don't know, six months ago, said, SaaS is dead. A lot of people said, come out, you're crazy.

But you know, though, Is there, does, does what occurs on Wall Street these days have any bearing on reality? Or is that just some little ecosystem bubble of its own? Yeah.

That do with what actually is happening in the real world. It's just investors playing games to short and long stocks, and, you know, it's becoming a casino, Becoming Has been, yeah. Has been, it's mining itself As a Casino.

There is going on here. I'm shocked. But there is that perception that Salesforce and ServiceNow are more vulnerable than others.

And, um, going back to something Barbara said with her experience at Intel, when I was at Gannett, our sales team had the same experience with Salesforce. They, they didn't want to use it, but they were forced to because we had a sweetheart deal with them. And it created all sorts of issues.

But I mean, I I actually think going forward, Salesforce shows in its actions, and it does plenty. It, it buries us. I can, Mike and I can attest to this, they are throwing news at us all the time, and it's almost like they're trying to prove something and try to overcompensate.

And I know it's a really sensitive issue for Benioff, and I think it is to a lesser extent. It its ServiceNow. Um, but so I think the market, John, wait, you're telling me Benioff is very sensitive and he is trying to overcome these things?

Very Yes. Yes. He said, uh, well, yeah, I wouldn't, won't deserve the following things about SaaS apps.

And I think for most people, the first place you wind up engaging with an AI agent is through a SaaS app because it's easy. And somebody built that and Adobe has them, and Salesforce has 'em, and ServiceNow has them. But I just think that that's the beginning.

That's ultimately we move to something that's a much more decentralized model where that AI agent sits on the client side and acts on my behalf. And it's not just an AI agent that I'm engaging with sequentially as I move from Salesforce to Adobe to whatever else. And these things will become, you know, my AI agent will talk to their AI agents, but the primary interface is my AI agent.

So, but no is the primary interface, your AI agent joining some AI agent only social network where they exchange and, and, and your AI agent gives up secrets about you or something, well see there and, and starts and goes to church to the, what are they call the crusty. But is that what you're telling me, Brad? It's got a, but it's got a 10 o'clock curfew.

It's gotta be home. It's gotta be, guys, it's 10 o'clock. Do you know where your agent is?

Um, do you know who, but John, John, to your point about Salesforce and, and ServiceNow here, here's my, this is my shimmy take on this. Okay. All right.

They knew this was coming. They knew it. They saw it.

They're smart people. Both of those companies are read led by very smart people. And they, a year ago, both of them came out big and said, we wanna be your orchestrator of agents.

We wanna manage the agents. We wanna manage not only our agents, but your agents, their agents, and everyone else's agents. They knew this is where it was going, and they were out in front with it.

And I just feel like the market's not rewarding them for that. Right? They're not, don't, don't judge them by what they did last year or the year before that, or that business.

These are two companies that they do see it coming and are trying to get out ahead. Now, is the market or the street saying they failed in that, or I think they're a victim of, I think those two companies are a victim of the hype they created. Like they overc created the hype.

So then as a consequence, wall Street doesn't forget these things and say, okay, prove it now. So I'm not saying that they, that, that, that they, it's hopeless. The situation is hopeless.

But I think that's the time that we are at now is, is the prove it stage. Meanwhile though, Barbara, to your point about Intel, poor little Intel, they already got spanked so hard, they can't really go any lower. And, and they're actually, and they're actually making some progress, Right?

They're, they're doing a lot better since I left, apparently. So that was the secret, I guess. Well, you think it was No, I don't think, I don't, don't blame yourself.

Don't blame yourself. Um, But why would companies go, why would you want to go public in this kind of atmosphere? Right?

Very hard to run a business with this kind of noise all running on the other side of you every time you wake up in the morning and you're trying to figure out an investment strategy and do the right thing by the business. But, you know, you got a bunch of Wall Street analysts and shall we say speculators just driving things one way or another based on God knows what? You know what, Mike?

com when, you know, I helped a company that we went public and I realized that, you know, managing a company to the street's, expectations quarter to quarter was not healthy for the long term, uh, health of the company. And, and I think, you know, to a certain extent, and I'm most socialist or communist, but if, if you, you know, five year plans or, or plans that don't have you tacking like a sailboat quarter to quarter left to right, right to left are better for the long term stability of, of some of these companies. Some, there's something to be said for that.

I, I just think like the, what it comes down to is the companies that thrive are the ones that really anchor on doing the right thing for their customers. Exactly. And, and companies that are overly preoccupied with how Wall Street is gonna react to their news are gonna experience these wild swings, and they're gonna lose, you know, kind of their, their north to the north stars.

The customer think they're gonna help the customer with their problems, then there's gonna be demand. Uh, and I, the thing I'm curious about with, you know, these larger SaaS vendors and their AI agents is will those be delivered in a way that fundamentally is tailored enough to what the individual customer needs to do? Because, you know, you've got all these capabilities out now where, like this weekend I'm buy coding, I create something in lovable, I replace one of my own monthly subscriptions because I created something that was perfectly suited to my needs and my use case.

So I take that on a larger scale with a, a massive company like Intel or, you know, whoever your customer is, if they can create their own very tailored solution that really fits the way that they work, that's gonna be a lot more compelling than this sort of out of the box generic approach where they're having to mold themselves to the way that the SaaS tool works. So that to me is really the fundamental question is, you know, when Salesforce delivers this AI agent solution, is it going to be really deeply customizable to the way that the company works? Fair enough.

I I think I, I think that's what we're gonna need to see. I also say, look, the, the far far, far overwhelming majority of SaaS companies are not public. And so will this same logic investor sentiment, you know, uh, carry over to private companies, venture backed companies that public companies seem to be going through.

I don't know. I don't know. Anyway, let's move on.

Let's move on our next, you know, getting a little bit away from ai, cyber criminals exposed. Oh, my, what's this one, Mike? This is a story that Terry has up on Security Boulevard, so I'm gonna let her get into the details, but I just gotta say, you know, there's nothing like a good story involving no honor among Thieves.

Terry, what's going on here Exactly. So well, this time, uh, the data that has been exposed on, uh, uh, uh, a website that, that actually kind of takes, its, uh, uh, its, uh, its name from or as an homage to shiny hunters. Um, it's, it's data, uh, from breach forums that, uh, on, on, uh, the hackers themselves, the cyber criminals by another cyber criminal, I might add who, uh, from his manifesto, um, which was quite well written or, well, you know, he's a illiterate, he, she is a literate person, um, but much aggrieved, um, has lost faith in, uh, the community of, uh, hackers.

Mm-hmm. Um, they, they're, they have turned into a greedy lot, maybe mirroring the, uh, companies that, uh, they once exposed, right? And yeah, so this is Like his Jerry Maguire moment.

It's, and, and I mean, I, I'd suggest everybody read that manifesto because I mean, the, the person is clearly smart, uh, is, uh, clearly aggrieved and, uh, just decided gonna go for it and revealed what, 324,000, uh, uh, cyber criminals, their names, their, you know, IP addresses, all sorts of stuff. Um, for defenders, it's kind of a double-edged sword. I mean, it, it's actually a, a good thing in one sense because, uh, they know who these people are.

They can, uh, adjust, uh, how they handle, you know, threats or, or, uh, whatever. But it's also, uh, uh, it's gonna change because you know how it is in this market, all the, all these, uh, cyber criminals, uh, or hacking groups or whatever, they disappear for a while when they get exposed and they come back as something else. We see that with ransomware gangs, we see that, you know, uh, with malware.

And at that, they'll, they'll end up doing that and they'll change the game. So all the threats that you thought you knew are no longer so relevant, um, in your organization. So this is a story as old as time, though, right?

So every time you have a revolution that people wanna fund the revolution, so they go start robbing banks, then they're surprised when they're hanging out with the criminal Allman, you know, Go, go see that, you know, and yeah. And then, you know, there's so many in that same scenario, so many ideological differences, right? Um, that somebody thinks, you know, their cause is holier than somebody else's.

And, you know, excuse me, I just saw one, uh, battle after another, so Oh, yeah. I'm, I'm sort of on that track anyway, Even, well, they, maybe they were influenced by the movie in some way Yeah. To Expose those folks.

I Dunno. Um, or maybe, you know, this guy just has a, this person just has a big, uh, ego and wants to show him that mm-hmm. You know, he's in charge and he can, you know, you know, There's a place for him in government.

There is a place for him in government in this administration. He would do quite well. Um, Alan, out of these 324,000 names, do you think that the authorities don't know who these people were already before this manifesto, or They probably had a pretty good idea.

It's just that they're in places they can't get to 'em. I think you give them more credit than they do. I don't think they, if they have 10% of them, I think it's a lot.

I, I think, I think right now you have, well, in normal times you would have FBI, uh, even the NSA CSA Interpol scouring this list and checking off, you know, if they're on the naughty or nice list that they already have, if not adding them to it and, and trying to, what, what would be interesting is you take all these names and run it through some of these big data like, uh, like a TransUnion or Equifax have, right? And start matching names and companies and ips to known, to known crimes and, and scams and everything, and put together, put, you know, connect the dots. Mm-hmm.

And you could make real, Hey, will we do that? I don't know. Well, right now, I don't think our FPI is in any position to do it.

And I think the collaboration, well, They're very busy, Barbara, very busy. They're very busy. I Don't know.

We can build simulations of their houses and have Navy Seals test and train there, and then just drop in and pick 'em up. We've done it before. Why use Navy Seals?

Just throw some, uh, mask on people and send them out? Well, I mean, maybe some of these ice people are gonna be looking for jobs soon enough, and, you know, Yeah. I'd like to see how many of them are on this list.

Yeah, no kidding. But anyway, it, it, it is an interesting thing, but it, and, and it also proves the old story. You, you know, you just, these things have a way of, of falling in on it themselves, right?

You never know who all of a sudden finds religion or thinks they found religion or whatever. Well, and I do want to just, uh, throw in there that, uh, the security researchers who sort of, you know, stumbled across all this or not stumbled across, found it at, at re security. They did, um, an analysis, um, of this whole, you know, event.

And they indicated, I believe it was them, indicated that they may know who this person is, but they're not, you know, publicizing, um, publicizing it at all. No, I would not be a good idea. Or I think no, in, In, in the history of organized crime, they have never succeeded till they finally get somebody to be an informer and then suddenly it all comes together.

So I don't think it's gonna be anything different here. Just gonna have to get some people to cough up and then the rest will fall. Yeah.

Hmm. Interesting. I don't know.

Interesting. Anyway, guys, we're about outta time, uh, for today's text on gang. What a great discussion.

Fun, informative, biting, Barbara, Terry, John, Mike, thanks for joining. Hey, we've got text on gang coming up. I wanna make a quick announcement too, as we're getting into things.

And today is Wednesday. We're thinking about pushing the gang a couple hours later in the day to accommodate our friends on the West Coast. John Schwartz, God bless him, bless you.

Gets up at, uh, you know, five in the morning to do these things with us. And, uh, so we're gonna, we're gonna move the gang live. 'cause now that we do it live, we, we have some leeway here.

We're gonna move the gang live to noon next week. Okay. Noon Eastern time, nine o'clock on the West Coast.

Oh. And that way it can be a little more timely in our discussion because Yeah, it gives us a little more time to see what transpired that morning. So we'll be up to the moment.

And, uh, John, we'll see you on five days a week. What can I tell you? I can do that at 9:00 AM I, can I get i'll?

I'm glad to do, I'm happily to do that. Yeah, Uhhuh. Um, I think it's good though too, because a lot of news is coming off around, um, 9:00 AM Eastern time, our player, so we stay ahead of the flood or the tsunami of news.

Yep. So stay tuned for that. That'll be starting next Monday, tomorrow Friday.

We're still live at 10. We still got Techstrong TV and everything else going on at Techstrong. But until then, Ms.

Allen Shimo for the gang. Thanks everyone.